Leading Multicultural Teams and the Future of Talent

Edward: Welcome to one more episode. Today I'm going to share a conversation, I hope very enriching, with Ceci Haro, an outstanding CHRO, uh, with a career spanning more than 20 years. We were looking for someone to talk to about leadership of multicultural teamsAnd well, Ceci has been to Colombia, London, Singapore, Mexico, and I don't think there's anyone better to talk about it, eh. So welcome. Thank you so much for being here.

Here are Haro's words: No, on the contrary, thank you very much for inviting me and I'm delighted to be able to share experiences, do's and don'ts and some hacks that might serve your audience, right?

Edward: Great, before you start to warm up, what would you say is the one about Human Resources People that you are most passionate about? Yes, I think that's a great question that all of us in Human Resources appreciate.

Here are Haro's words: Look, I think, Eduardo, that What I like the most because in the end it's the topic of talent, isn't it? How do you connect business with people, isn't it? I know that sounds very simple at times, but nowadays many organizations are, you know, having a very big challenge between being able to understand what the needs are so that this business can go as far as it wants to go, right? I always talk in interviews with me and in podcasts that throughout my career I have seen a lot of PowerPoints or presentations in various tools, now that we are with Artificial Intelligence, about how you can project a business, how much does one cost, right? How much do agrochemicals cost in the world. And in the end, when you get to the time for people, well, that's what it means if your growth is really going to reach that place as long as you establish the People's strategies, isn't it? So, to me that I would tell you is the part that I am most passionate about.

Announcer (Magneto): Brutal. The people who should be at the center of organizations, right? And that today it is a challenge for many Human Resources managers to achieve, uh, that there is this synergy between people and business objectives.

Here are Haro's words: Total. I love it.

Announcer (Magneto): Hey, well, to get a little into the subject, hey, we talked and commented on this evolution, uh, of the talent market, of how, well, more and more we have to manage teams with different landscapes, with different cultures, hey, and I would love to start by asking you what are the main challenges, the challenges faced by, uh, the leaders of the organization, but from the Human Resources area obviously, when managing teams, uh, with different cultures?

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Multiculturalism

Here are Haro's words: Yes, and here I'd like to talk without necessarily looking for it, right? And I think that here comes as a first lesson, and that is that there are certain organizations that allow you to start thinking a little bit globally, right? So, I was at Diageo and it's a super multicultural company. That's where I think I had, like, that awakened maybe like this concern for me, didn't it? Hey, then another very important one I had was, uh, going to an MBA program in London, right? And there he, I mean, I can tell you that there yes I truly lived the culture shock. I had never, and you know, come from living environments in Colombia, from living in very diverse environments and I never imagined that I would really experience such a strong cultural shock to be living there, right? Hey, it's work culture, it wasn't easy. From the outset, look, the weather, the weather really does have an impact and we take that for granted. Hey, obviously the university I went to was super good at guiding me in saying, “Hey, if you feel this way you're having culture shock and no, come with us and we'll help you,” right? And then it's another one of the learnings, which is in the end because we're not alone, right? And today with so much connection that we have, I mean, that would be a piece of advice for the audience for me, it's like in everything there are always tribes and communities where you can, uh, recharge, right? Where you can find support. So, that was another important moment for me of working with other cultures, of having teams and work cells. Well, in my where I was from the MBA we were 45 nationalities and 72 people, isn't it? So, it really was, uh, an incredible experience. And from then on, the next strong experience is Singapore, isn't it? I'm going to live in Singapore, another world that's another world. Hey, next point, because it's also a Chinese company and its headquarters were in Israel. So literally, uh, let's see, again, right? This company and that I think it starts here a little What to do or how to do it, this company supported me a lot in having a cultural coach and we worked with a supplier who tested me. It's literally a calculator where I can give you some images of what it looks like, where you measure eight aspects and you have to see who you are, who you are in the country where you are a native and how it compares to the country where you are going to work. And the surprising thing is that As a Mexican I had a lot of differences with my own country. So, that's when I understood why in Mexico I sometimes, you know, had certain complications. Example, isn't it? In Mexico we are very people-oriented, I am more results-oriented than people-oriented. So, I said, “Oh, now I see why in Mexico sometimes you... see these challenging situations,” right? So, well, that one would tell you, that tool was great for me, but especially here I think and closing a little, the answer, Eduardo, is to keep in mind that multicultural teams, let's see, first the high-performance equipment is designed, you know, it's not like you put great people together and it's going to happen. Put very talented people, a high-performance team requires design and requires a lot of strategies to get to that place of collaboration, right? And second, obviously the multiculturalism becomes another factor in which, as it is, a competence, isn't it? And I don't know if I'm going to arrive at such a simple conclusion, but the subject of self-awareness, to simply understand what is the difference between my behavior and my perception of X cosa and your perception or your interpretation, isn't it? Because there are so many things in the multicultural world that can be interpreted. I always told my teams at the end of my stay in Asia, that in the end I obviously had some experience learning from mistakes and everything, hey, and I would tell them, “Every time they go to put an email saying 'I assume' this one, because assuming is just what we don't want, right? Because in other words, you're obviously there, 'I think I think that what he didn't want to tell me' and all this part of the interpretation is better to go and, you know, in other words, 'Eduardo, what you wanted to tell me was this', that is, confirming, 'this is your expectation', because in the end there were a lot of misunderstandings that obviously impact the business, in other words, in the end, right? In other words, even if they are conflicts that drain you energy, they are conflicts that cost the company a lot of money.”

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Edward: Brutal. First I want to make as a footnote for, uh, the audience that maybe some of them will say, “Hey, my company is a local company, which only has a national reach, I don't manage anyone from abroad”, but I think all this learning is very valuable. In the end, well, the Culture is all the customs surrounding all the people in our organizations, so even if it's a very local and small organization, I think that all these examples and this seems very concrete and very valuable to me that each person, regardless, even if they are from the same place where they were born, because everything that is around them impacts their perceptions, their deep motivations, right? And I think it can be very valuable that if someone believes that they are an example that is very, uh, far from their reality, try to think that well, culture is something close and everyday, do you agree?

Here are Haro's words: I totally agree, I love what you say because this doesn't sound too far away, I mean, we don't have to think about Asia or different continents, hey. I also had the experience, Eduardo, of working in Morelia, of working in Puerto Vallarta, let's say in Mexico itself you may have certain things that you don't understand about the other, right? And what I come back to the same thing is the subject of Don't assume and today when we have so many stimuli, so many communications that we are doing many tasks at the same time, the communication between us has to be increasingly clear and efficient, isn't it? And that's obviously going to require a certain connection with people, understanding, understanding, uh, that there, in other words, the other person can get the message through their own culture, right? In other words, like the antennas, the ears that we have, um, they have back there and well the personal experience that also no longer...

Edward: Exactly, that's what I was going to tell you, we're not adding to it yet, uh, you know, your stories, right? The other day I had the opportunity to attend a webinar, uh, from a company that is doing more studies about trauma and the relationship with leadership and the relationship with work teams, right? And then obviously, imagine, no, I've never thought about that, but obviously this webinar wakes up like, “Okay, besides the traumas that each of us, prejudices, everything that we are, uh, obviously impacts, doesn't it? In the way we connect and collaborate with others”.

Here are Haro's words: Completely. We're people and you can't separate like we often think we work in boxes, right? Here's work, here's family, here's personal hobbies, uh, but no, the person is like, uh, uh, a union of many factors, isn't it?

Edward: Yes, as is. Hey, and thinking about these challenges of leading multicultural teams, do you have any anecdote, any project, any experience where you had to overcome, in other words, these barriers of different languages, different ways of thinking, as paradigms or different conceptions of how to execute a project together? No, I don't know, like I would love it if you would share some of those stories with us, from any of your experiences.

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Cultural Shock and Adaptation Tools (International Experiences)

Here are Haro's words: Yes, I would like to tell you what happened to me when I arrived because I think that when I arrived I just learned everything, right? And when I probably made all the mistakes, uh, that allowed me, you know, how to reflect, to realize what other path I was going to take. Obviously I could tell you that the final part of Asia was already feeling more comfortable, I was already swimming more easily, I was sailing easier, eh, but the arrival was complex, wasn't it? I'm not leaving and he, that is, the boss that I had, my CEO, was Australian. So, uh, very funny, just the cultural calculator they gave me matched a lot that I was getting along well and had many of the eight aspects coinciding with Australia, didn't it? He helped me a lot to understand how, “Ceci, don't worry, that is, I understand that you already have the coach, that you already have all this, but also live it, that is, you also go and do what it is, that your personality, that your person can also transmit something”, right? And well, there came a very technical project that was the implementation of incentive plans, sales incentive plans for the sales forceI mean, it's a super technical project, eh. We did it because in the end, well, because of the business situation, the analysis we were doing of EBITDA, there was a great opportunity, uh, to turn the financiers around through this sales incentive Human Resources strategy, right? But obviously seven Asia-Pacific countries away from me sitting in Singapore and I could tell you that was the biggest challenge, not understanding business and culture at the same time. What did I do that was interesting or, shall we say, was the key? And I know that maybe it sounds again, no, like very simple, but it was Build the relationship, you know. In other words, this boss that I had gave me the time and space to be able to go and tour the country where I was about to implement a project, eh. I remember that I'm going to give an example, no, when I went to Vietnam I looked to stay in an Airbnb with a family. OK, and I looked for it for that purpose, so I said, “I want to understand how, that is, how people live”, right? In Mexico, in the end, when you go to any country or when we receive people in Mexico, we take it as if to the most beautiful places, right? But what a father it is to live an experience that really immerses you in the daily life of culture and with different, no, social strata. So that was a key for me, no. Each of the countries I toured them in that way as well as in a way that was more, uh, connected to culture and what these families were with. Well, in the end, the project had a lot of, uh, let's see, which obviously had issues of time because it was understanding very technical concepts and also the language, right? And I have a super funny anecdote, when we launched in Indonesia the translator got sick. Okay. So, literally, obviously not, my boss opened the meeting, had to translate another person from the team and that's it, so, you know, we presented the project in Bahasa, which is the language in Indonesia, uh, we did some work cells that involved, you know, even going on a calculator and seeing how much I was going to earn, and so on, as the most technical and implementation part. And the truth is, I can tell you that my boss and I turned to see each other and it made us laugh, right? Like, “God, I mean, what are we doing in this place in this place implementing something so important.” But in the end, uh, I can tell you that So the key was to trust people, to, you know, to seek support from them And well, the truth is that we did it, didn't we? There's nothing you can't, uh, do when you gain that trust with people and you build those relationships, right? But in the end, well, it was one of the most complex projects I would tell you and that required much greater resilience on my part and that's when I think I learned, that's where what I understood was, I really have to study cultures, I really have to understand their values and I really have to know that each culture will even have a different timeline, isn't it? I remember at the end of my stay I had already done, in other words, all the Gantts I did as regional implementations changed the times by country because I already knew what country I was going to put on, so, you know, in Thailand they're going to say yes to everything and then I'm going to realize that I wasn't. So, I'm going to have to do something again and that's fine, I mean, that's how it is as a country.

Edward: Yes, yes, exactly, yes. We share a lot, it's much more than we think, besides being spicy. Hey, and I mean, maybe it's a conversation for another time, but thinking about incentive plans, of course, it touches on very important parts of the business, financial, but in the end you're talking about the motivations of this sales force, which are often the lungs of companies. Did you see any difference that I don't know if it was the same incentive plan for all countries, but that in some countries it didn't have as much resonance as in others?

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Adapting Incentive Plans to Local Culture

Here are Haro's words: Yes, what a great question and I have an incredible example that you reminded me of with that question, which was very often in Indonesia. We had, when we analyzed financials, we saw that we had a delay in cash flow. OK, for one of those countries, which was Indonesia. It was big, it was a country that we say sells for a certain amount of time, but we always had a delay. And so when we designed the incentive plan, that example was, “Hey, well, the CEO of Indonesia was called Final and we said, 'Hey, Final, let's see, we need the money to be collected, hey, you get paid faster than you're charging today', right? Because that would help P&L a lot, and so on.” And he told us, “No, I can't do that because, I mean, my clients have their times, if I come and charge them, hey, I'm going to offend them, so culturally I can't do it.” And then, obviously my boss was like, “Hey, no, I mean, tell him no, I mean, tell him he has to collect it first.” So, that was, I would tell you, one of the issues where we also had to help Break that paradigm. In other words, we launched the incentive plan by reducing the time and accelerating the incentive if they reduced the time. And when we launched it and told them, “That's the way it is because Israel, because so on”, hey, they said, “Okay, so now let's see how we're going to convince our customers that the collection is going to be sooner, that the collection is important in this way.” And I could tell you that he went off topic, that is, that there are times when you are culturally at a crossroads, that is, you know that it is how he says no and he is from that country, it has to be done this way. I mean, where are we going to go? And I feel like it's like a clash of needs and of and of issues, right? But again, in other words, it's time, it's communication and well, a lot of the Building the relationship.

Edward: What what what how crazy. How could you arrive with the product bias it works perfectly, the processes are well established, this is going to work like a charm in another geography, it's just moving one thing to another, but no, it breaks everything for you.

Here are Haro's words: Yes, and there are aspects that, well, you know, no, we have to, uh, understand, right? I see now in Mexico that now that I have been in Mexico a few months ago I see how we say, “It's just that in Mexico it's not like that”, right? And this company comes to make ABC and poor company, right? Because he doesn't understand the values of culture or he doesn't understand some things where how important it is to really understand, how important it is, uh, to live with that culture for a while before you come to conclusions and bring solutions to the table.

Edward: Yes, speaking of the topic of nearshoring, that's going to be a very interesting challenge for American companies, for Chinese companies and well, in general, Asian companies. How interesting, Ceci. And let's see, you had the opportunity to naturally and before the pandemic already have all this multicultural experience, hey, I think the pandemic was a catalyst that transformed organizational cultures, right? This dynamic of hybrid and remote work which allowed that today you can have people, uh, from the same team in different countries. How do you see this transformation? What what impact does or eh have on the pandemic, tell us, in other words, how is it, how is this transformation that began with the pandemic transforming company cultures?

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Impact of the Pandemic on Organizational Cultures and Hybrid Work

Here are Haro's words: Yes, I think that as you rightly say, Eduardo, hey, the Pandemic accelerated it. I think the pandemic forced us to live it, right? And it was, in other words, I think that there were a lot of topics that we wanted to do but that the business simply didn't allow it. Above all, I think that business leaders are the ones who are ultimately concerned, and I fully understand this, about productivity and return, right? When I suddenly see the meetings that take place at those levels where there is so much pressure, uh, because of the numbers, it seems that this topic is completely disconnected, doesn't it? The issue of where to work from, and so on, isn't it? And that's good, obviously, from where the team is most productive, isn't it? I particularly experienced this issue of transition in Asia. My boss was a baby boomer and we had a hard time, I can tell you, I mean, just to give you an idea, the Mexican embassy in Singapore, which is wonderful, sent me an email like, “If they still make you go to your office, this ambassador is sending you this email that you share with your bosses to get them out of the offices, so we can't keep working from the office.” And it cost me and another colleague to accompany my boss to this place, I mean, you know. I still remember the scene when he was like, “How am I going to take calls from my house if never?” He had never experienced the topic of working from home or working from somewhere else, had he? I wasn't going to Australia for that very reason. So, uh, I obviously experienced all this change, didn't I? Going back now to 2025, I consider and what I observe, and I don't know how you see it in not this interesting industry that you're in that is taking place like a return, right? In other words, since we are once again returning to before the pandemic to discuss the same issues of what people are doing while I don't see them working in their chair and they don't come out at 8 o'clock or they don't come out after the boss, hey, I see that there is a return to, in other words, we're kind of going backwards, but I also see in the middle that we didn't have the time and it's something that I challenge my teams a lot in terms of doing, uh, meaningful interactions. I mean, when we, uh, had the pandemic of going home and then it hit me like this hybrid, right? Good, some come, some don't. I even had, for example, visits from business leaders and I was, “Well, the team isn't here because today they work from home,” right? Things like that are so strange that you say, “Wow, I mean, why are we getting to experience this”, because it's a lack of connection, isn't it? Because it is a lack of leader to be working too and the leader has an essential role in this in this game, right? Hey, what's my team doing? What goals did I set for him? No, uh, how productive are you being? Well, only I know how to answer, right? No one at SE level will be able to answer how productive your team is doing more than you as a leader. So, I think that right now I don't know what times are coming. The other one even heard Elon Musk say that the topic of hybrid work is a topic of low morality, that I said, “Wow”,

Here are Haro's words: ... that is, he said, “How is there a person who is working at home and another person who does have to come to the office or does have to go to the factory?” No? But also to that, obviously and with my interests and with the passions I have, the issue of being able to see the insertion of many women, for example, into working life with these hybrid environments, because the truth is that it's super simple, isn't it? So, when we say that it is one or the other, we are also giving it, we are probably closing the door on a lot of it. Diverse talent which can bring interesting skills, right? So, I see it out there. I don't know no no...

Edward: Brutal, in other words, I think that here we can throw ourselves two full episodes simply in the debate that if remote, that if it hybridized cultures, I really am seeing a return to human interaction. I mean, I was impressed.

Here are Haro's words: Hey, yes, yes, and it has, I mean, it has its different sides of the coin, right? In other words, I think that there is also a part that the leadership is still understood as a part of authority and control and I'm the one who guarantees productivity. For me, those leaderships are going to tend to disappear.

Edward: Yes, I think that the challenge of hybrid cultures presents us with a leadership challenge, in other words, which is just what you say, because we simply think that these remote living policies are sometimes simply defining whether the employee goes to the office or not, but there is much more, isn't there? Hey, if you go to the office, what are you going to do? Do the functions of your role make sense in the office? Where is it most productive? Where do you feel most comfortable? No, so there are also many cities, such as Mexico City, where mobility is chaotic and there are many employees who waste 3.4 hours a day just to get to the office. So, I think it also has to do with what you were saying about the cultural understanding, of not assuming leadership and saying, “No, it's just that working in the office works for me, it should work for everyone.” Yes, uh, but it's a very complex topic, isn't it? It's a complex issue.

Here are Haro's words: I think the more flexibility we have, the greater possibilities we have of accessing talent, isn't it? I mean, you and I both know and well, you're much younger than me, but I can tell you that, um, ever since you were very young there was this one, I could tell you like this cliché...

Here are Haro's words: ... or every year we end up with it, the talent crisis, skills gaps, hey, “you can't”, “not that much percentage of people who can't fill so many vacancies that remain unfilled”, and so on. That has always existed, uh, ever since I started my life in Human Resources, right? But I think we've spent little time looking at how to solve that problem and how to actually solve it, not solve it with techniques. I see, no, we're still talking about Nine Box from, I mean, let's say, and we know why it was, right? In other words, they are techniques made by great consulting firms, used by Jack Welch, who turned GE around and built the largest CEO factory in the world. Yes, but in the end today we are having four generations working at the same time. Nowadays I would tell you, no, uh, we say that we have those talent gaps, but again, if we are not flexible we cannot bring that talent. If we can't think that that talent can be in another country and I have that skill in another country and I'm going to pay for it in a certain way, that's another way of doing it too, isn't it? And a third one, and that is perhaps also for another topic, but something that I had experience doing with one of the companies where I was in Asia was the subject of making a Inventory of competencies of your of your of your company, isn't it? That is, we do, we are still thinking about organizations from the point of view of job description, we have not reached the topic of skills.

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Talent Crisis and Solutions: Beyond Job Descriptions

Edward: In addition, the position evolves in six months with the speed of business today.

Here are Haro's words: And that, “Hey, you're also going to have another project and now you're going to have another topic”, and so on. And we realized that it was really a way to solve the problem, didn't we? But today I think that part of us doing our own inventory is missing, that is, before we go out looking for that Rockstar that you are putting in the description, you could do that project with small gigs and you could combine the talent that you have today to do a project like that. I think you can explore that out there, right? But I insist, these are three or four ways that I see in which we have to solve a problem of talent gaps in order to deliver in business, right? And the more square we look, the smaller...

Here are Haro's words: ... we will be able to solve the business issue for you.

Announcer (Magneto): Hey, and you mentioned, in other words, the topic of four generations working together, that also generates some kind of gaps, a complex culture because everyone has their own perceptions, “this has been done like this for years”, right? All these paradigms, uh, and these specific exercises, because I mean, it sounds really cool to do an inventory of competencies, but in the day to day that the operation is eating you up, it's hard to give priority to these projects, right?

Here are Haro's words: Yes, I think that's where it comes from... great and right now we're going to get into it a lot, but like my question was, “What to do so that those projects don't stay in a folder?” No? Many times talent areas face that here is the inventory, here are the policies of I don't know what, and business leaders say, “What a great thing Human Resources did, that's how things are done here”.

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The Need for a Connection Between HR and Business: Collaboration and Purpose

Here are Haro's words: Yes, I keep seeing and I was just thinking about it, wasn't I? I keep seeing a relationship, uh, of a single channel. In other words, I keep hearing the very famous phrase that “Human Resources people speak business language”. Look, that's why I went to study the MBA. So I tell you how strong that statement, which impacted me so much, that I said, “No, I mean, I'm a psychologist, I'm a coach, I am, in other words, everything I've studied is about psychology and Human Resources, behavioral design, and so on, and I said, 'No, I mean, I'm tired of this statement that HR people don't understand the business, I'm going to go get in to understand him and talk about business', and that's what I did.” So, literally, when they accepted me to college, I spoke to Dean and said, “Look, I feel very challenged in my work because I feel like they say all the time that HR people don't understand the business. So, it's my one of my most important reasons to change residence, to invest all my savings in this MBA.” He told me, “Well, okay, if that's your goal, forget about being Human Resources in any of the exercises we do and I'll do that to you, I mean, you know, and I'll make sure that happens.” So, that's what I did. I already understand the business, I already understand it. I spent a lot of time watching P&Ls, but I need to hear when leaders will also understand and speak that human language, do you know? I feel like it's like, well, uh, I've thought about it, uh, I mean, because you don't believe it, it's a topic that worries me, and it's How do we bring in CFOs who are the first you encounter in those battles of, even if you give data, even if you give numbers, even if you throw in the business case, in many moments the pressure, uh, for the number and for the deliverable, I know that they eat them, isn't it? And the CEO, I mean, how do we make this community where we can actually speak the same language? I don't always tell my HR colleagues, “I lack business people at all of our HR events. Because if we continue to do only HR, it is a language and a problem that we discuss with each other, but we need the CEO to come and ask us for the best, you know, in other words, almost therapeutic, but that we can make this connection of channels that in the end we are going towards the same objective”.

Edward: I love it. Just as Human Resources are required to talk about business, business leaders should be encouraged to talk about people.

Here are Haro's words: Yes, great, great.

Announcer (Magneto): Ceci, coming back like this, then, technology, remote living expanded and you were talking about the possibilities of the labor market, closing these talent gaps. And today we are seeing what you can hire, there are many companies that have their development and technology team in South America or India, even with the time difference. And so we are seeing different talent hubs where certain countries are filling in gaps that exist in others. How do you see that it is evolving? In other words, how do you see that impact on the world of talent and how do you see that the topic of attracting talent will tend to evolve and it has everything to do with what you said about every year there is the crisis of not filling these positions, we still have these gaps? What positive things do you see in him? What negative things? What is your perspective on this shift in the talent market?

Here are Haro's words: Yes, I think that let's see, look, my first experience of this kind was when I was at Diageo. We migrated all over Latin America to a share service that was in Norwich, a business decision as it was, “Hey, we already have the machinery here, why don't they bring them to Latin America to do business here”. What happened? Well, I mean, you know that in the end a lot of these big companies do the opposite, right? Latin America serves North America because of a matter of cost and skills, and so on, no. Well, there was a big cultural shock there, wasn't there? Because obviously the service that Latin America expected was much greater than what the United States provided, once again, cultural differences, wasn't it? So, uh, I think the same theme this one right now from all these companies that are taking resources from different countries, The most important thing to take care of is that this collaboration can really happen, that it is not getting more expensive and that the service that is promised is actually being delivered. I mean, I think that's the biggest challenge when you have an operation of that level. Something that I'm seeing but I don't know if it's just my perception and I would love if there are any experts listening to us with data, hey, I think and not just because of what's happening in the United States, but I think it's being done more and more locally, that is, More and more countries are taking care to hire their own people. Hey, I saw at one point as a little bit more global flexibility, uh, some companies sponsoring visas, uh, much easier and I see that in the pandemic and after the pandemic I see that that part is kind of contracting. So, obviously because companies are having less diversity, uh, in leadership positions, maybe some transnational corporations can afford more luxury, but I see that contraction. What do I think diversity gives? Well, it definitely gives a lot of innovation and gives a completely different way of solving problems, but I said it almost like a broken record during my stay in Asia, because you have to design it, in other words, it's not that I'm going to put seven nationalities together and I'm going to create a soccer coaching product as is, no. In other words, we have to design those experiences, that is, that is behavior. No, well, in one of the classes I took with a teacher that I love, he teaches behavioral science and he would say, uh, he would tell us, “Remember that the human brain is made to survive, not to succeed, no. The brain is there, our brain is made to be comfortable”, no. That's why it's so hard for us to acquire habits, that's why, uh, it's so hard for us to change our ways of thinking because we like to go to comfort, right? So,...

Here are Haro's words: ... let's see, the fact that you have a lot of diversity in a team makes you uncomfortable and what tools are you going to use and what new behaviors are you going to develop? Well, that requires help, not that it is given in a non-involuntary way.

Edward: Brutal, brutal, and in the end that discomfort necessarily leads to growth. And on issues of attracting talent, well, you were saying right now that you see that flexibility is contracting. Yes, hey, hopefully that forces the education sector, the academy to start generating local talent because I do think there are a lot of holes and we talked about it before. Hey, how do you see y and y starting to close the technology in the equation in everything, no, in cultural management? I mean, obviously, what allows us to have these video calls would be the obvious. But what do you see that cultural management tools are bringing to the game?

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Technology as a Key Ally in HR: A Call for Coherence and Connection

Here are Haro's words: Yes, I would tell you, that is, for me and on the subject of CHROs who are very surely listening to us, we know that technology, I think it's one of the issues that doesn't let us sleep in terms of how to find that simple solution that gives you relevant data to have these great conversations with the business, hey, that allows you to make very quick decisions and that allows you to make predictive decisions even, right? I think that you will be able to see it in no no without names at all, but there is a topic of gigantic, multinational companies worth billions of dollars that today have up to six, seven technologies talking to each other and no one gives a concrete report of things that allow them to make decisions, right? That's the one for the for giant companies, isn't it? The way you implement simple and fast technologies, hey, and for the other side for me is also and I told you a little bit, right? The fact that all these technological solutions can be discussed and understood what is the role of Human Resources and these C-levels in running a business, right? Because today you still find a lot of vastly different solutions, don't you? In one of my experiences I was looking at a Human Resources system and I couldn't find an ATS, right? An Applicant Tracking System that was strong, not everything else was strong, but it didn't have an ATS, right? And then we joined the ATS and I also saw certain gaps with regard to, for example, how to manage internal talent, right? How to promote to people that this ATS could do it to me too, right? So, what do I see and what would I like and this is a call perhaps also to your audience that is listening to us from companies that make technologies Well, talk more to each other and try to understand more to the customer what we really need? No, today if today people who are dedicated to Human Resources technology are a key player for the future, key to our decisions, right? Nowadays there are already tools that allow you to decide, you know? , who is at risk in your company of going out and making million-dollar decisions to retain talent. So, you know, the benefit they give is very great, but I still feel that it is very fragmented and that this sense of community is lacking, that is, of course, we are all a business and everything is going to have a business in the end, but we are also changing the world when we make differentiations with technology, right?

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Edward: Share and coherence between business, technology and the fact that in technology there are going to be different players and there are going to be different players, different needs, but in other words, the people who are dedicated to technology, every time I talk to people who are dedicated to technological issues, I love it, you know, that is, every time you talk to an expert about something, it inspires me a lot and it's like, “Okay, how do I convey that this project is super important, that it has this end-to-end, that I need you to give me these results?” I think we still need to connect that part.

Here are Haro's words: Brutal, brutal.

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Recap and Final Thoughts

Edward: Hey, to close, hey, I would like, I mean, I have a question that is burning on my tongue, if Ceci is going to set up, start as a C in a new company and is going to set up his Dream Team around, that is, what would you say, what positions, what people does a CHRO need today to speak business, to manage all the tasks for the talent challenges in a market where well, hey, it is increasingly difficult to find specialized positions? In other words, how would you summarize those people who are key and surely you are also thinking about names that you have already had in your teams? But how would you organize that team, that close circle of a CHRO to create, uh, magic?

Here are Haro's words: Yes, I think, you know, one step before people is the design of the structure you need. In other words, I think that the The operating model of Human Resources is much more important than what we have considered. And I obviously observe these models of the Human Resources operating model in very large companies, which is very clear and that it comes from other continents, but it seems to me that in Mexico we need to sit down and think about exactly what this operating model means, right? We continued, and I was talking about it the other day with someone who said to me, “Yes, yes, I think that the famous Day Bullrich model, where there is HR Business Partner, the role of the HR Business Partner came very quickly, the name came very quickly but very late the actual execution of the role of an HR Business Partner and the capabilities”, right? From the last thing I did, I worked with Gartner precisely to see these models, the Agile model and all these issues that are already so in vogue to see Human Resources teams obviously from the specialty and from which they deliver to the business, but also from skills and additional projects that could take, not only, uh, those of everyday life, right? So, I would say that coming back, once you have what operating model the business you're in can really serve, uh, well, I would say a team, that is, if you told me a competition that the whole team should have, because it's obviously a academic training. I always talk about the fact that, uh, I've seen a lot of people who say, “Hey, no longer the, I mean, you can't be successful anymore, you haven't succeeded in your career, so become a teacher or go to Human Resources”, right? And the truth is that neither of us, no, this one, I think that being a teacher is incredibly the role of a teacher is incredible and so is the role of Human Resources, right? And it requires a design and it requires an academic background, hey, I would tell you that connection with the with the purpose, that connection with the famous business that we're talking about and I think that the topic of How do people get in and how do people get out. I mean, I think that the entrance, the front door and the exit would be, in my view, uh, areas that require additional competence, uh, that has...

Here are Haro's words: ... what to do with a lot empathy And you know how with passion, with things that maybe sound very spiritual but that in the end, uh, I think entering and leaving a company has to be as smooth and as beautiful as you know as when you change any topic, isn't it? And today the other day I heard, no, someone who said, “Your culture is defined in how the person leaves your company”, right? And I think it's important to always take care of him.

Edward: Thank you very much, Ceci, uh, I think we're left with a lot more to talk about, eh. I don't know if you want to share something with him to close the audience or maybe leave a question, hey, and I would also like to know what you think and if you could summarize this episode, this interview in one sentence, what would it be?

Here are Haro's words: Well, I really appreciate you inviting me, Eduardo. I think I learn from the great intention that you and your company have to generate knowledge and you know, to generate access to people to solutions to important problems in the world. So, I take that reflection with me, uh, I told you, no, that I wanted to recommend to your audience in the case of those people who are going through a topic, uh, cultural, that feels, I always say so, as if they put you in a washing machine and that's how you feel when you're living in other cultures, learning from so many subjects, uh, this book that is called The Culture Map, uh, it's by Erin Meyer and she's a super super, uh, theorist, she's studied the subject of cultures a lot. This even if you are not experiencing cultures you can do your own test of what the values are and compared to Mexican culture how we see ourselves, right? , this is managing teams, and so on. So, it's quite entertaining and good, it also opens a door to your audience for any conversation, for me you know any conversation always gives me a lot of energy and teaches me a lot. So, anyone who wants to approach me, I'm on LinkedIn, I'm very active there and I'm trying to deliver important messages for me and for the world.

Edward: Ceci, thank you so much for being here. If I had to do a recap, hey, I'm impressed, it's something very simple but the subject of Not assuming and understanding the cultural position of the age of people's situation, eh, is key to the success of organizations. Two, the very valuable topic that Human Resources speaks business but let business leaders talk about this part that can sometimes seem romantic or spiritual, but in the end we are people, isn't it? No, we're not numbers, hey, and three I'm left with several tasks, I loved the subject of the skill inventory, I'm going to start thinking about what we have to do here at Magneto, hey, and the book, in short. Thank you very much for being here.

Here are Haro's words: Thank you very much.

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